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piperonyl t1_jahiqln wrote

Original news story will get millions of views while the correction will get thousands.


DelianSK13 OP t1_jahj5zk wrote

Or there won't even be an updated article on some of the places. But yeah, sadly you're probably right.


Hib3rnian t1_jahjn77 wrote

And the businesses mentioned/showcased will lose out the most.

I'm curious if anyone will be held accountable for the false hype or will it just be another media shoulder shrug?


tehmlem t1_jan6aod wrote

Seems like both the manufacturer and the retailer would have grounds for a civil case against the cops in a reasonable world.


nouveau_user t1_jairggk wrote

even the fucking correction says 'maybe didn't contain fentanyl'


BFreeFranklin t1_jahj1ek wrote

The only thing this whole story is missing is another supposed OD-through-touching claim


DelianSK13 OP t1_jahk5nk wrote

Reporter: Tell us how you found out about these fentanyl gummies.

Cops: Well we walked in for our morning coffee and my partner all of a sudden fainted and started seizing. I knew right away there was fentanyl in the store.

Or something.


Redlar t1_jai3juw wrote

>my partner all of a sudden fainted and started seizing

So much for the 4th Amendment!

("against unreasonable searches and seizures")


siguefish t1_jail8qz wrote

Cops are going to pass men’s soccer players in fake distress events.


Grashopha t1_jahm12y wrote

As a recovering addict and multiple OD survivor, those videos piss me off so much.


Dr_Worm88 t1_jai0jcg wrote

As a person with a functioning brain these videos piss me off. Copaganda at its finest.


DelianSK13 OP t1_jahiagp wrote

>It turns out that the investigators who performed the original tests used some ridiculously sensitive portable equipment whose threshold for detection is .01 nanogram. One nanogram is equivalent to 0.000000001 grams, which, if my decimal-place counting is correct, is the same as one billionth of a gram. And that’s for one nanogram. In this case, we’re talking about a threshold that is one one-hundredth of said nanogram.
>Over the weekend, investigators sent the supposedly fentanyl-positive products off to a lab for further testing. And the lab found absolutely zero illegal drugs in any of those products. It’s unclear what the lab’s detection threshold is, but it’s clearly more than .01 nanogram, an amount that wouldn’t even begin to get a person high.


Excelius t1_jahzdcb wrote

It's been well known for years that the field tests that police use to detect illegal drugs are error prone, a lot of innocent people have been arrested and charged because of false positives from these tests.

Washington Post - Why are police departments still using drug field tests? > In 2016, a report by Pro Publica and the New York Times found widespread false positives and user errors by cops when administering the most popular tests. Precise error rates are hard to calculate, because some test results can be affected by variables such as weather conditions, user error and lighting conditions. Some studies have shown error rates ranging from 1 in 5 false positives to 1 in 3. But even those disturbing figures can get worse if you create an incentive for a police officer to want a positive result. In 2009, the Marijuana Policy Project used the KN Reagent field test on 42 substances that weren’t marijuana. They were able to get false positives on 70 percent of them. > >The ProPublica report also found that the most commonly used tests didn’t include warnings about the high false-positive rate, despite a 2000 guideline from the Justice Department to do so. Surprisingly, the report found that more than half of those wrongly charged after a false positive actually pleaded guilty, an indication of how the threat of serious jail time can persuade innocent people to falsely confess.

This has been known for literally decades now.


goplantagarden t1_jai1zp6 wrote

I wouldn't rule out outright lying. The police know the media vigorously pursues any crime story, unfounded or not, and factual follow up may or may not happen. And a lot of cops LOVE to grandstand and get that super-hero treatment on TV.

US media generally sucks, but I do love ProPublica's in-depth reporting. They really care about getting their facts correct.


internet_friends t1_jaj1ljp wrote

It is a form of lying. The device they're using gives a false positive rate of 20-33%. In addition, it appears that when the police gave the report, the neglected to mention how MUCH fentanyl was found and what the lethal dose is. This is all information that the police have known for years and have been advised against using this type of device. The fact that they still use it and want to grandstand with these headlines IS lying. If these types of practices were used in any setting other than a police one they would face jail time and a hefty fine. What they're doing is a form of falsifying test results which is illegal in the state of Pennsylvania and many lab directors have gone to jail and have been forced to pay fines for this in the past. The cops should not be able to make these statements and the media needs to due their diligence in fact-checking these reports. I fact-checked this article when it came out and figured out that the device they used gave a high rate of false positives by googling it for 5 minutes. We as a nation deserve more out of our police and out of our journalists. This news story is unacceptable all around.


NorwaySpruce t1_jaj0ewx wrote

It's like the dudes in Texas who are being brought up on felony charges for a D8 cartridge because the police won't actually test it to see what it is. They don't have any jurisdiction over this stuff so they're lying to people to get them scared about it


Anonymous_Otters t1_jajy03s wrote

Police drug tests aren't for identifying drug, they're for justifying injustice.


heili t1_jai78dr wrote

You can get those things to test positive without ever even opening them or adding anything to them.


HeyZuesHChrist t1_jakc790 wrote

It’s right up there with “I can search your vehicle because my dog told me you have drugs.”

Fucking insanity.


calebnf t1_jahm6pj wrote

Is the fentanyl in the room with us right now?


Au2288 t1_jahrxt7 wrote

Show me on this doll where the fetanyl has touched you.


ChadGreenshirt t1_jahmpg2 wrote

I work in a local hospital and we had a rash of folks coming in who said they take these gummies and that they were actively overdosing. Picture perfect example of the placebo effect and hysteria in action.


Diarygirl t1_jahs56f wrote

That's why I could never work at a hospital because I'd be so tempted to say "you wouldn't even be able to talk if you overdosed."

Those videos of police supposedly coming into contact with fentanyl and passing out don't help matters either.


ho_merjpimpson t1_jai5tqd wrote

To be fair, many people legitimately feel like they are overdosing after eating edibles.


AgentInCommand t1_jahkava wrote

Maybe cops are just hyper-paranoid cowards? Sure seems like you could just say the f-word and they'd run for cover.


Grow_away_420 t1_jahktra wrote

When you have shitty tests being performed by bias observers, you can't be surprised when drugs are detected everywhere


chainmailbill t1_jaiebhh wrote

Biased observers, unless the observers are the ones who are there to observe the bias.


Kidgen t1_jahpy3a wrote

When will people learn that they aren't going to lace a cheaper drug with a more expensive one. It's like parents thinking people will slip their kids drugs. Drugs are expensive and if there is anything most people like more than drugs it's money....they aren't giving it away for free.


ThePopeJones t1_jahsuey wrote

Oh God..... I remember going to Nee York city in high school in '03.

My gram warned me about Pourto Rican drug dealers. She said that they would hide under cars and pop out and blow drugs in your face to addict you......

I have no idea where she got the idea from. I've never heard it before or since.


Kidgen t1_jahxkth wrote

Bahaha! My partner calls their grandma, Gram, and they are all from PA. She is also a bit of a nut! I friggin love her. Must be a Gram thing.


ThePopeJones t1_jahzmlz wrote

Lol, I've heard the "gram" thing before. Never realized it was a regional thing until recently.


Kidgen t1_jai0jrn wrote

Honestly I'm not sure if it is but it seems like everyone has a "Gram" here. My favorite part about it is she will smack my partner for biting their nails and I call it a "gram-slam"


ThePopeJones t1_jai0v8p wrote

My gram HATES swearing. She will lay the smack down on anyone dropping an F-bomb in her hearing.


dbe7 t1_jaiulll wrote

This was the big message in the 80s during "just say no". People supposedly had drugs injected against their will just once and then they were addicted for life.


steampunkedunicorn t1_jakp9w2 wrote

My grandma said the same thing!! But it was Chinese people in San Francisco blowing opium in your face.


ThePopeJones t1_jal3esr wrote

Damn! Did she also have this weird obsession with bees climbing into soda cans? Mine ABSOLUTELY knew, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that any unattended can of soda had a bee just waiting to sting the inside of your throat.....


steampunkedunicorn t1_jalvnbf wrote

No, but I have first hand experience that's led me to always check my sodas for bees. I've had a couple extra spicy root beers lol


fucklawyers t1_jak1ave wrote

I heard that one. Instead of NYC it was Brazil, and the drug was strychnine. The story was they’d blow it in your face, and you’d happily unload your entire house for them.


Excelius t1_jai0tcl wrote

> When will people learn that they aren't going to lace a cheaper drug with a more expensive one.

Fentanyl is cheap, and it's been pretty well documented that it sometimes turns up in other drugs like cocaine and meth. Either intentionally to create a "speedball" type product, or unintentionally because of cross-contamination in the packaging.

That said I certainly agree that the concerns over marijuana are overblown, and there's especially no reason to think that a gray-market item like Delta-8 THC edibles would be either intentionally or unintentionally laced with fentanyl.


MooseNoises4Bauchii t1_jak3ur2 wrote

I def wouldn't buy from a random place, I bought a delta 8 cart online but got some recommendations first where to get it from. They sent lab test results from the batch inside the packaging. I think it's smart, just covering their own ass and avoiding legal issues.


raven4747 t1_jai248n wrote

I mean the facts are that the "legal edibles" in PA are pretty much unregulated and anyone could put anything in that shit. why take a risk with that? all it takes is one asshole on the production/packaging side to put something funky in there and really have you fucked up. maybe not fentanyl but do you really trust these shady gummymakers to not cut costs and put something in there that's not good for you?


raven4747 t1_jai23oe wrote

I mean the facts are that the "legal edibles" in PA are pretty much unregulated and anyone could put anything in that shit. why take a risk with that? all it takes is one asshole on the production/packaging side to put something funky in there and really have you fucked up. maybe not fentanyl but do you really trust these shady gummymakers to not cut costs and put something in there that's not good for you?


tehmlem t1_jai302p wrote

Wait till you find out about supplements


raven4747 t1_jai3h4e wrote

true but at least with supplements they are usually produced by actual companies with a documented presence in society. good luck tracking down any of the "legal edible" companies, if they are even registered as such.


tehmlem t1_jai4n68 wrote

That's an incredibly vague standard not supported by the facts. The larger point is that delta 8 is exactly as regulated as similar products but gets outsized attention because drugs bad.


thenurgler t1_jahtps7 wrote

Well, in a decade, people will be warning against gummy bears with fetanyl, just like tainted Halloween candy.


DelianSK13 OP t1_jahui3n wrote

I give it until this October honestly. And the original article saying the cops found fentanyl in them will be the main source.


thenurgler t1_jahul5h wrote

No, I mean like, all gummy bears


DelianSK13 OP t1_jahwezs wrote

Oh! Yeah, I could see that happening.


internet_friends t1_jaizwpz wrote

This did happen last year around Halloween. Maybe I'm going crazy, but I definitely read some hyped up Facebook post about how you need to "watch what candy your kids get for halloween" because "gummies have fentanyl/THC/etc in them"


vaxinate t1_jai2x5x wrote

There was a ton of propaganda about “rainbow fentanyl” that could be easily mistaken for sweet tarts going around during Halloween last year.


heili t1_jai7qtu wrote

My local police department is spamming that shit out now.


tehmlem t1_jahjf5a wrote

I don't wanna brag but I totally called it and want to brag


HaileSelassieII t1_jahq1rp wrote

So Republicans forced the PA mmj program to disallow edibles "because of the children", if I'm remembering correctly that was extremely important to them. Now that it has resulted in unregulated edibles being more easily accessible by minors, I think we can all agree that was a dumb fucking move that didn't help anyone, children included. (And, they should have been aware this was a potential issue because we have been dealing with synthetic cannabinoids/Spice/K2 for over a decade now, luckily these products don't contain those substances but it's still related and something they should have been aware of, they're in every gas station)


Diarygirl t1_jahro6k wrote

So even if we get legal recreational use, we're still not going to get edibles, I guess.


HaileSelassieII t1_jar19ds wrote

Maybe not, they may have fucked themselves, because something that has changed in that period of time is that older folks have realized edibles are very helpful for tons of medical issues. They are very popular with older people now, I don't think the "think of the children" strategy is going to work this time (see Florida's medical program for example, they have edibles and are more conservative politically, their program started a few years after PA if I remember correctly)


[deleted] t1_jahtrb9 wrote



raven4747 t1_jai1phm wrote

missing the point that for kids to get dispo edibles, they need an adult with a med card. the dispo system is pretty regulated and every purchase is tied to your name. as opposed to the "legal" gummies that are largely unregulated and much easier for a kid to purchase or get their hands on. even if an adult were to purchase one of those for a kid, if they paid cash there'd be nothing connecting the transaction to their name. dispo edibles would be a much safer and more secure alternative.


ReformedDeviant t1_jahr4ps wrote

Police lie as policy. That has been established.


pwnedkiller t1_jai6qdj wrote

The lesson here is never let police conduct a drug or alcohol test on you. Always demand a test be done by a medical professional at a hospital.


ulfricstormclk t1_jahwy2o wrote

Not surprised at all. I was highly skeptical of the original news story.


SamuelLCompassion t1_jaif6ee wrote

I'm glad that I can now safely consume my gas station THC gummies without fear.


tehmlem t1_jan6u5a wrote

You know what bugs me about the general air of unease about delta 8 products? Anybody who's been smoking longer than a decade has smoked shit a stranger gave them in a sandwich bag or the torn off corner of a grocery bag. We were all willing to trust that guy your friend knows but we're supposed to freak out about what might be in gas station products? Gas station is a step up from buying from the guy behind the gas station!


shewy92 t1_jahr12s wrote

2mg or .002 grams is the lethal dose. They tested for nanograms or .000000001 grams


Castorated t1_jakslbi wrote

The standard unit for quantitative and qualitative analysis in the US for Drugs of Abuse Panels is ng/ml. It's the case for nearly everything including things like Gabapentin where positives can be in the millions. Still measured and reported as ng/ml.

Edit. Changing DAU to say just drugs of abuse. Because gummies are obviously not urine.


Super_C_Complex t1_jahzur6 wrote

Just a reminder. There are people in jail for probation violations because these tests are bullshit.

Certain probation officers I know will intentionally fuck up the tests so they pop positive.

The only way to know what's actually in something is to send it for testing and even then your can't be sure since the labs are often in cahoots with prosecutors or are addicted themselves or just are bad at their job and do batch testing.


Alternative-Flan2869 t1_jaiip09 wrote

Just legalize recreational cannabis and sidestep all of this monumental waste of time, money, resources and hardship.


axeville t1_jaj9vyp wrote

Product contamination is a valid reason for legalization

Tylenol you buy from target isn't tainted these days.


Mijbr090490 t1_jajmgo8 wrote

Exactly. We wouldnt even be having this conversation if it was regulated much like it is with the MMJ program.


_SundaeDriver t1_jairsqm wrote

Wow, this is not surprising in the least


milkyZONGrips t1_jaj4km8 wrote

woah woah, you're telling me the cops lied??? no way man...



H5A3B50IM t1_jaj873m wrote

This gave me “razor blades in the Halloween candy” vibes from the beginning.


brutustyberius t1_jahxrpf wrote

The police did report they were high as fuck after taking the THC gummies, but noted no affect from the fentanyl.


PPQue6 t1_jaii6uz wrote

Oh wow really, I'm so shocked....

No one is fucking spiking anything with Fetty.


cashonlyplz t1_jailpmh wrote

To all the people called it: good job


Mijbr090490 t1_jajlzyq wrote

My comment from the original story stands. Legalize it. We wouldn't be worrying about dangerous drugs getting into it if it was regulated. A lot of the D8 stuff is is unregulated garbage. We don't have these issues in the MMJ program. It is heavily regulated and rigorously tested.


LockedOutOfElfland t1_jamduf3 wrote

I have had terrible, terrible experiences with publicly available delta 8 and delta 9 with side effects that persisted long after they should have. Would not recommend.


Boomer70770 t1_jakx6ix wrote

Well no shit. Fentanyl isn't free.

Why give it away in the hopes of what?

Selling more gummies?


bdana666 t1_jak58be wrote

The police LIED? Who could believe it? Good cops who protect bad cops are bad cops.


Pretend_Activity_211 t1_jakuafi wrote

Idk if we should call delta 8s thc. It's altered, they change too much


H_P_S t1_jajnxas wrote

you mean to tell me that the cops lied and the media just ran with it? no wayyyyyy


VendaGoat t1_jajrdwu wrote

I'm shocked, SHOCKED! Well, not that shocked.


shaneroneill t1_jalehyw wrote

They were just eating it? Lol, I’m glad they’re ok, nobody deserves to OD


mbz321 t1_jamvmfp wrote

I'd be more surprised if these gas station gummies actually contain delta 8 :P


jawntothefuture t1_jaiehej wrote

It isn't hard to get 🔺️8 that is third party lab tested


jmdunkle t1_jahl1gz wrote

The article headline and post title aren't exactly true though are they? Fentanyl was detected by sensitive equipment, but not by lab testing that [theoretically] has a lower threshold for detection. I know everyone here is getting defensive because we don't want our fun, legal high to go away, but isn't anyone concerned that any fentanyl was discovered in these gummies? There should be zero. Not a very small amount or so little that you couldn't possible get high off of it... zero. Fentanyl being where it shouldn't be is deadly. I've had a close friend die from fentanyl-laced heroin. It's no joke. This is why we need this market to be regulated.


Karrius12 t1_jahnoe4 wrote

Sensitive equipment has to be used properly, or else you get false positives.

I want you to think about a dollar bill for a second. Just your average dollar bill.

Chances are, it has some cocaine on it.

That dollar bill has 20,000x the amount of cocaine on it than what the police are claiming they tested on the gummies. 20,000x!

Forensic science, especially in the hands of the cops, is fake more often then not. Real analytical chemists never make the kind of statements those in law enforcement do. We also understand our equipment and detection limits.


Diarygirl t1_jahsg6c wrote

I blame shows like CSI for people's misunderstanding of this.


Karrius12 t1_jahy2bt wrote

Absolutely same, but also the way forensic science is abused by the legal system is to blame here, too. So much of it is literally fake


jmdunkle t1_jahnyok wrote

I'm not eating a dollar bill though


Karrius12 t1_jahqrb9 wrote

Right, but the point is, that number is so small as to basically be fake. We're talking 1% the weight of a human cell. These kinds of instruments are extremely sensitive, and will ping off of nothing, or noise. Even then - its hard to trust whats actually being detected is fentanyl. A lot of analytical tests simply arent that specific.

It's not that theres some contamination - its that this detection process only pings under extremely specific circumstances that aren't actually happening.


AgentInCommand t1_jahlg7r wrote

I'd argue you have it exactly backwards, these cops are so high on their own supply of fear that they can't help but see fentanyl everywhere. Bordering on mass psychosis triggered by the exaggerated crisis of their own invention.


daywreckr t1_jai2d8s wrote

It's how they keep the govt money and overtime flowing.


jmdunkle t1_jahnu48 wrote

Not sure the equipment that detected it is affected by the scenario you laid out there


AgentInCommand t1_jaho2gy wrote

The positive test threshold is so low that it's within the margin of error. You're basically getting a result that says 1, +/-1; you can call that a false positive, if you want to be charitable to the group that is making a spectacle of fentanyl at every opportunity, but it sure seems to border on malicious to me.


Karrius12 t1_jahqxur wrote

It absolutely is. Analytical chemistry often requires a trained analyst to be able to correctly interpret results - even then, often the best you can get is "This is consistent with X... but could also by Y or Z or a ton of other things."


DelianSK13 OP t1_jahn1ks wrote

I'm sorry about your friend. I don't think anyone is poking fun at the fact that fentanyl does exist and kills people all the time. And I agree that these sort of gummies should be regulated and tested.

To be fair the article isn't exactly clear. They say the cops found it on their machines that test at such an insanely small level but the lab did not find any. The author even says he doesn't know the labs detection threshold. But if a lab who deals with this stuff on a microscopic level doesn't find anything and the cops are saying "it's setting off OUR testing equipment" then the issue is probably with the cops and their equipment.

Are we 100 percent sure there isn't even .0000000000000000000000001 percent fentanyl in the gummies? No. I don't know that you could ever be 100 percent certain on that. But it is very clear now that the gummies the cops took weren't responsible for the deaths of the people that caused the cops to investigate anyways.


withinthearay t1_jahlym8 wrote

You're absolutely right about fentanyl not being a joke. And I completely agree with you about a regulated, legal cannabis market. But about the testing equipment, I assume the equipment they brought to the store was not as accurate as the lab test they performed. And the lab test turned up no illegal drugs, not just a smaller amount. But that is how I interpreted the article.


[deleted] t1_jahq0zx wrote



jmdunkle t1_jahqwgn wrote

A lot of "probablys" in that reply. I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but you're making tons of assumptions to fit the outcome you want.


edit: spelling


Karrius12 t1_jahrwkr wrote

Even if you do think fentanyl was actually present, at the detection level of, again, 1% of the weight of a human cell, contamination from a handler or the lab is extremely likely.